I’m sitting here wondering how we could possibly be doing this test so far down the line? It really boggles my mind…
I was chatting to the lovely Sam the other day, she was telling me about her follow up appointment with Dr V and said that he has suggested that her and her hubby go for Chromosome blood tests, we also discussed IVIg, intralipids & HLA bloods. They too have just had their second fresh cycle fail. I was concerned since Frank and I have never been for these tests and by the sounds of things, it’s quite an important one….see here: http://www.pregnancymd.org/genetics-and-infertility.htm & http://www.dnadirect.com/web/article/testing-for-genetic-disorders/infertility/140/chromosome-disorders
I mailed Dr V, asking him if Frank and I should go for the chromosome tests, I also asked him to clear up IVIg vs Intralipids and whether it was a embryo quality issue or an implatation issue with NK Cells we were dealing with….here’s his answer:
Intralipid is ostensibly for NK cells and other immunological issues. As discussed previously I do think that we have not had a good outcome due to embryo quality. This is however intelligent speculation and nothing more. Chromosomal evaluation is an option. The likelihood of an abnormality is around 3% – 4%. In the past we use to wait until the 3rd failed attempt before doing chromosomes due to the costs involved. I have recently started doing the after the 2nd attempt and was going to address the issue with you at the next appointment. You are therefore welcome to do it in the meantime should you wish to do so.
I hate seeing the words Embryo quality even tho he says it’s just intellegent speculation because they can’t really test embryo quality but think about it, we’ve had 16 eggs - only 5 suitable for transfer on day 3, then we had 15 eggs – almost 100% fert rate but only two usable blasts on day 5. I then start to wonder if we’re beating a dead horse. Yes, we’ll do intralipids and maybe that is the answer but maybe it’s not, maybe it’s our embryo’s and then maybe we’re wasting our time.
I phone Frank in tears and tell him that I’m not sure that we should keep on doing this, he tells me that we’ve known all along that it may be a quality issue but seeing it in writing is different. I ask him (because I can’t remember) if embryo quality it likely to change, he says he doesn’t think so but embryo quality depends on the eggs and sperm at the time. He gets annoyed with me because I’m opening another can of worms and we’re not supposed to be thinking of this now…..sigh
I suppose we’ll see with this next one, if this next one fails and the embryo quality is bad again then maybe it’s time to hang up our gloves. Of-course I told Frank that all we need is one good blast to make one (just one baby - that’s all I want) but if this third cycle doesn’t give us that then the writing is pretty much on the wall. The stats show that your chances of success go down after your 3rd Fresh cycle fails. I suppose we’ll decide if that happens but I must be honest and say that I’m peeved! We only have a 3-4% chance of there being a chromosonal problem but if it turns that there is one, our chances of having a biological child go out the window. Surely this test should be done sooner? I mean really….I would rather pay R2800 up front before starting down the IVF road than over R100 000 to find this out. Maybe I’m being overly sensitive about this and maybe I’m not in the right frame of mind to deal with any of this yet.
Frank and I will be going for the bloods sometime in the near future, the results take 3 weeks to come back, I have loads of questions for our appointment in June. I want to know if we wasting our time here, it’s not his fault by any means I really do love Vitalab but I’m so tired now, this needs to end…one way or another.
Tam, do you know what I’ve learned through all these years? This is not an exact science and 90% is pure speculation. Use my IVF as an example, everything was PERFECT but its still a BFN. And please don’t say that the chances of success are drastically reduced after IVF#3, I already have so little hope after failed IVF#4!
Ultimatley, I think its essential to trust your Dr, believe he has your best interets at heart and is doing everything he can to get you to the ultimate destination.
Thinking of you.
xx
i have been following your blog and i felt compelled to write as i had a very similar situation to yours…i am now 28 weeks pregnant following ivf #4. it could be a total fluke, but we did try a different type of protocol which worked for me. if you would like to talk about, please feel free to email me. good luck and hang in there!
Can you guys do PGD (preimplantation genetic diagnosis) on day 4 or 5? That will for sure tell you about embryo quality (from a chromosomal perspective). Does your clinic also do assisted hatching?
Either way, the more testing the better is how I feel. I just needed some answers (which, of course, I never got — except my high FSH). I hope that you get your answers soon. But even more than that, I hope you get your baby sooner.
For what it’s worth, it took until our 4th fresh cycle to get it to work. So 3 isn’t always the magic number, but it sure does take a helluva toll on your heart, your mind and your body after a while.
Tam, I must say I feel the same. My embryo quality also seems to be a problem and of all the IVF’s we also got a lot of eggs, but very few embryos in the end and I have also wondered whether they should not do these test sooner.
I am at the stage where I am prepared to give it one more try and if it does not work, then I am finished.
Good luck!
Tam my friend I hear you… where did you hear that your chances reduce after IVF # 3? Please don’t say that is what Stephan said cos I might just have to slit my wrists
Here with you all the way my friend! Call or email anytime to vent.
xxx
Tam, Well I think it is a lot to digest.And nothing is ever gaurenteed.
One step at a time.
The problem is that they can never tell you what is wrong, they just guess. Look at me, Ive done 4 cycles and now we definitely know its an egg issue, its like trial and error, it sux though.
As for the chromosomal testing there are two kinds – to check that you dont have any deletions/additions of a chromosome (the R2800 one, which by the way is covered by MA, well at least my MA paid for that) then there is the hectic HLA testing (costing a staggering R10 000!), this tests your actual DNA to check if you are a carrier of anything or check for similar genetic markers. You need to find out which one Dr V is talking about. At R10 000 I think that is a bit steep but if it gets to the bottom of the problem?
We had the chromosome one done last year and it really doesnt say much except that our chromosomes are fine.
Hey there Chicky. I know your frustration. People kept telling us not to bother with the HLA’s and chromosomal testing as the chances were so low…. well what do you know – My and DH’s genes are so similar we could be cousins (but are NOT) As you know IVIg was the not answer for us despite our genetic problems. There is no clear answer and I agree with you that we should be able to choose upfront about the additional testing.
At least now that we are aware of it we can consider other options that may be better for us as a whole.
Thinking of you guys and commiserating with your tough decision making.
Mands xx
Hello? Are you there? Thinking of you. xoxo
Hi, cool post. I have been wondering about this issue,so thanks for blogging. I’ll probably be subscribing to your blog. Keep up the good work